Pokémon trading cards are their own economy | The Vergecast

(upbeat music) - Welcome to "The Vergecast," the flagship podcast of the Pokemon trading card game. I'm David Imel. In the last couple of years, Pokemon cards have gone from a fun collectible card game to an entire market. There's a massive ecosystem taking place here from casual collectors to players to bulk buyers and even Discord bot servers. The Pokemon Company recently released a 30th anniversary celebration set of the cards, which was notably different from the way that other sets have been released, both in just the sheer volume flooding the market and in the rarity of these cards. This has caused a lot of drama and sparked a lot of conversations in the community, so I wanted to bring on "The Verge's" Charles Pulliam-Moore to talk about it. But first, here's what's happening on "The Verge" today. This is 90 Seconds on "The Verge" for Tuesday, September 29th, 2026. Today's OpenAI Dev Day, one of the biggest events of the year for the company, and it kicked it off by announcing Dots, a Meta Muse competitor. OpenAI says that Dots is an always-on AI assistant that can do nearly anything across connected apps in the background while learning your preferences over time. Dots is powered by GPT-6 Astra and lives at a cloud computer, which gives it access to a web browser and over 4,000 supported apps. Dots will also be available in Microsoft Teams and Slack. OpenAI says soon you'll be able to interact with it over text messages as well. Next, Nothing announced its first pair of professional headphones, the Nothing Headphone 1 Pro. The $399 pair of over-ear headphones offers a triple driver design, Auracast support, and a dedicated flat EQ switch which removes the audio processing. The goal here is to offer a single pair of headphones that you can use to enjoy your music, as well as a profile you can use to mix your music with. John Higgins says that the active noise cancellation's not quite as good as the industry leaders, but it is the best of any Nothing headphones so far. And finally, Google officially confirmed it will stop updating Chrome OS in 2034. On the one hand, it's not that big of a surprise as the company shifts its attention to Google Book OS. But on the other hand, it means that if you bought a Chromebook this year, you probably won't be getting those 10 years of software updates. Or maybe your Chromebook will just turn into a Google Book. Google has said that many Chromebooks will be capable of upgrading to Google Book OS, so hopefully more details emerge before 2034. You can read more at theverge.com. That's 90 seconds on "The Verge" for Tuesday, September 29th, 2026. (upbeat music) - [Announcer] Support for the show comes from Amazon Prime. Some of us are blessed with a natural ability to do gift-giving right. You probably have a few in your life, people who can make a mental ledger of what their loved ones like and buy things here and there throughout the year. My mom has always been the best gift giver in my life. She could even make the smallest gift feel incredibly special because you knew that she had really thought about that person receiving it. It doesn't have to be the biggest or the most expensive gift. It just has to show someone you were thinking about them. Well, for the rest of us, here's a tip. Prime Big Deal Days is coming October 6th and 7th. That means that for two straight days, you can get deals on those kitchen gadgets for your dad, electronics for your brother, fitness equipment for your bestie, toys for the cousins, and so much more. There's new deals dropping every day so you can become one of those expert gift givers that we all know. And it's all happening with plenty of lead time into the holidays. So no more scrambling to come up with something last minute. The hardest part will be finding a good hiding place for it all. Mark your calendars, shop new deals every day this Prime Big Deal Days, October 6th and 7th. (whimsical music) - Charles Pulliam-Moore, welcome to "The Vergecast." - Hello, hello. Thank you so much for having me here. (chuckles) - So you just wrote a story on the site about the state of the Pokemon scalping ecosystem and what's happening with this 30th anniversary set. Just to set the stage here, can you explain why Pokemon cards in particular are such an insane commodity right now? I feel like I could buy these when I was a kid, but the last couple of years it's just exploded into its own ecosystem. - Yeah, I mean, you're bringing up you being able to buy them when you were a kid, that's part of it, right? I'm not sure how old you are exactly, but I imagine we were both there for the beginning of Pokemon. What's happening right now is kind of sort of similar to what happened when the cards first hit the streets. There was all kinds of news coverage about how popular the game was and how cards were just out of stock. Back in the '90s, people were not so sophisticated in terms of their pursual of these things. It was just kind of like, all right, you're going to go to your Toys "R" Us or KB Toys and see what happens to be in stock and you just make do with what you've got. But now in 2026, the Pokemon brand hasn't gone away. It has only gotten bigger and more popular over the years, and that has translated into an intense focus on the cards. And in 2026 in particular, in this moment in which hustle culture has sort of evolved into this beast of a thing where everyone's looking for quick ways to make money and then encourage other people how to do it, Pokemon sort of represents an ideal kind of commodity to sort of pounce onto. I feel like every other month we're hearing a story about like, "Oh, these cards from the base set just sold for an exorbitant amount of money that makes absolutely no sense." And some of that is because people have nostalgia for the cards, but it's also the card collecting has taken on a life of its own that is fascinating and distressing all at the same time. - Yeah, just to sort of brief people on this, do you know why these decided to randomly take off? When exactly did these start taking off? Because I feel like it was around 2020 or so, but I could be mistaken here. - Yeah. I mean, Pokemon has... Again, Pokemon's always been popular. Shades of this have always sort of been present within the Pokemon fandom and within the Pokemon card collecting community. But I do think that the pandemic really made things worse for a number of reasons and in a number of different ways. During the pandemic, people were at home and everyone was just on their computers because they couldn't go anywhere. And Pokemon's an easy way to grab attention, whether it be, oh, I have some cards here and I'm going to open them on camera, or I'm going to show you the kinds of unexpected places that you might be able to buy Pokemon cards. That all really got big at a point in time when everyone's attention was much more on the internet because they just weren't outside. And now things that the pandemic, it's not over, but lockdowns are obviously relaxed, we're able to go outside, but this intensity has sort of not gone away. It's just sort of intensified over time. And now (exhales) with the rise of platforms like... The rise of platforms like TikTok has kind of exacerbated it just because there are more avenues through which people can consume this kind of content. - Yeah, so you're saying that there's sort of a new market for this content's consumption which is driving people to actually go and make it. - Yeah. Yeah, like, Pokemon's always been here. I feel like social media in 2026 has given Pokemon a new level of brand exposure to people. They're just more people who are aware like, "Oh, those games are still going on. Oh, the card game is still a thing." I remember being in New York in 2017 and walking through a Target and you just walk by the card selection or the card section and there would just be stacks and stacks and stacks of Pokemon cards. You could just buy them very casually, which wasn't indicative of them not being popular, but it was more that the community of people who were focused on it was much smaller. And now it feels like more people are much more aware of the fact that, yeah, certain Pokemon cards can be very valuable. There are people who are willing to spend quite a bit of money for them. And in that realization, people are like, "Ooh, I could also make some money off of this." And so people have just really kind of pounced on it. A lot of what we're seeing with Pokemon right now, it's not new. This is like sneakerheads now. This is just how it's always been. Not always, but sneakers have been, they've existed in this kind of space for a much longer time where people are willing to line up out front of stores for hours on end just to get a pair of Jordans that they are maybe going to wear, maybe going to wear once or twice before they flip them to someone else. Sneakers, (chuckles) there are all kinds of, like, difficulties with selling sneakers. People don't have the same size feet. So it's like, all right, I've got this shoe and a size eight, so maybe I can flip that. But with Pokemon cards, it's just the card, right? We don't have to get into the whole ecosystem of grading and stuff because that's its own kind of thing. - It's probably its own "Vergecast," yeah. - Yeah, but it's like, oh, you pull this Lugia card and you know that it's worth a few hundred dollars. And so the goal is to buy up as much product as you can, maybe pull that card, flip it, or you sell that product with the intention being you are looking to get this into the hands of people who are trying to chase that thing. - Yeah, I want to get into that, because I think we've all seen a lot of people taking videos of Target store openings. It'll be like 70 AM or 8:00 AM. There's a line of people outside of a Target. They're rushing in trying to grab as much product as they can. What's the deal with that? Are they just reselling as many cards as they can in unopened, or are they ripping them open and then trying to sell the rare cards? What's generally happening there? - It varies. I've gone to a couple of these, I don't want to call it a lineup event. I've been standing out in front of a Best Buy before it opens just to get my hands on some cards because it's almost impossible to buy them online at this point. Brick and mortar stores tend to be your best bet to get something. And just having conversations with those people, it's a multitude of different types of folks who are doing this. Some of them are scalpers, resellers. Some of them are just casual fans like myself. I've got a huge collection, and I have them to look at them. (chuckles) You know, I'm not a competitive player or anything. It's a mix, right? I think (chuckles) weirdly enough, the let's line up in front of a store of it all, where does that come from? Some of it is like sneakerhead culture, but a lot of it I feel like got popularized by Apple with iPhone Launches. I don't think people... Apple's gotten better about making sure that they have adequate stock to deal with the people who actually want to get the phone. But in those early days, it was a thing that people did for fun. It's like, "I'm going to be... We're going to camp outside of the Apple store to get the thing." That was, the Apple of it all, that felt very much sort of like an event of sorts. It was something that people treated like a fun thing to do, whereas with Pokemon cards, it's more sort of like get there early, get your stuff, go home and do with it what you will. - Yeah, well, a lot of these people are basically scalping these cards, right? So I want to talk about the scalper ecosystem a little bit here. - Let's talk about them. - In your piece, you sort of mentioned that there are these Discord channels that you can pay for that will give you access to scalping bots that can basically automatically buy a ton of different packs online as soon as they release. Can you talk a little bit more about that ecosystem and how that's evolved over time? - Yeah, so like I mentioned earlier, buying things online is very difficult in large part because the reseller economy has sort of adopted these tools that make it easy for them to accumulate product in bulk in a way that your average person can't. So when you hear people talking about bots, what they're talking about are automated programs that basically, how to put this, they brute force their way through sales where it's sort of like the bot will continuously try to add something to a cart and then check out. They are programmed to have access to your credit card, which is usually... How to put this? They usually use virtual credit cards. So you come up with a fake credit card number that's actually attached to a real credit card. That fake credit card is attached to a fake account because a lot of these retailers, what they do is they do take some steps to prevent this kind of behavior. If they see too many orders coming from a certain IP address or from a singular account, they'll be like, "Nah, you clearly aren't a person who's just buying this for yourself. You are trying to accumulate stuff." But what these bots do is they make it really easy for you to pretend that you are multiple people and sort of source all of this to yourself. And so these resellers frequently use these tools in order to buy up all of this stuff. In addition to those tools, they will commonly congregate in Discord servers where they have automated pings that are designed to let you know when a certain product has been loaded into a store's backend. Target is known for doing drops at like 3:00 in the morning for whatever reason, and if you are interested in this kind of stuff, you find a couple of these discords, they're buzzing around from like 12:00 to 2:30, people are just chomping at the bit, foaming at the mouth, ready to pounce, pounce, pounce, pounce, pounce. Notifications go off, they activate their bots, and they will just secure multiple orders in order to get this stuff for themselves. After they acquire it, oftentimes the sites will cancel some of their orders, but usually the more of these things that you're using, you are upping your chances of getting a successful sale. After they acquire it, they usually end up flipping it to a number of different kinds of people. Sometimes it's to individual people. It'll be a collector who missed out on a site sale, and so they'll come to one of these resellers knowing that they're going to have to pay anywhere between double to triple the price, like the MSRP. But oftentimes these resellers go and sell things to card shops. They sell two card shops or they will take them to card shows, all with the intention of offloading it for much, much more. They're never trying to break even. It's always about trying to make a profit, which means that all the prices are ridiculous. And it just makes the whole collecting hobby very not great. - Right, so there's multiple middlemen here, right? There's the discord servers that are selling access to the bots, there's the people buying them, there's people reselling them. There's different types of resale. There's individual cards, there's whole sets. - Yeah, and the thing that's fascinating about the discords, I get into this into the piece, the people who are in these discords are obviously interested in reselling. That is a particular kind of money that they're trying to make. But the people running the discords will often... They treat it like a subscription service where it's like, "If you pay us $75 a month or $600 a year, we will give you access to all of these tools. We'll teach you how to do it." So the people running the discords, the Discord in and of itself is a business. That is a revenue generator for them, which is fascinating. I think that's like, "Oh, well done." But also like, "Oh my God, you guys, this is..." - Another middleman. - Yeah. - Yeah. (upbeat music) - [Announcer] Support for the show comes from Outshift, Cisco's incubation engine for frontier technology. Multi-agent AI is in every enterprise roadmap right now, but here's the problem everyone's facing. Agents can pass messages, but they can't think together. These systems silently underperform through cognitive failures, misreadings, unverified claims, false consciousness, and conventional monitoring can't detect them. Outshift by Cisco is building the fix with their new comprehensive resource, the Internet of Cognition. It's an open source guide that's a foundation for building multi-agent systems from design to production. The goal is to give agents shared context, shared memory, and guardrails, all to drive the results we actually expect from AI. You can lean on this resource to understand agentic AI's evolution and how it has shifted from isolated agents to orchestrated superintelligence. You can gain insights for how to future-proof your business by tackling complex challenges with multi-agent systems. You can read the paper, experience the demo. Grab the code from outshift.com. That's outshift.com. - [Announcer] Support for the show comes from Amazon Prime. Some of us are blessed with a natural ability to do gift-giving right. You probably have a few in your life, people who can make a mental ledger of what their loved ones like and buy things here and there throughout the year. My mom has always been the best gift giver in my life. She could even make the smallest gift feel incredibly special because you knew that she had really thought about that person receiving it. It doesn't have to be the biggest or the most expensive gift. It just has to show someone you were thinking about them. Well, for the rest of us, here's a tip. Prime Big Deal Days is coming October 6th and 7th. That means that for two straight days, you can get deals on those kitchen gadgets for your dad, electronics for your brother, fitness equipment for your bestie, toys for the cousins, and so much more. There's new deals dropping every day so you can become one of those expert gift givers that we all know. And it's all happening with plenty of lead time into the holidays, so no more scrambling to come up with something last minute. The hardest part will be finding a good hiding place for it all. Mark your calendars. Shop new deals every day this Prime Big Deal Days, October 6th and 7th. (whimsical music) - I want to get into this 30th anniversary set that just dropped recently. - Yeah. - It seems a little bit notably different from the way that other sets have gone. Other sets, it's like there's all these unique cards and they haven't been printed before, but now there is all these sort of original cards that are being reprinted for 30th anniversary. As well, it seems that there are just a lot more cards being printed in general, right? - Yeah. - What is the drama going on with this 30th anniversary set? - So the 30th anniversary drama is... (chuckles) So there have been anniversary sets before. I wrote about this back in, whatever five years ago it was, for the 20th- - 25th. - For the 25th set where the big chases were... Charizard is always a chase regardless of whether it's original or a new one, but they reprinted the Charizard, Venusaur, and Blastoise card from that base set, and everyone was like, "Oh my goodness, like, Charizard is one of the..." Charizard is consistently one of those cards that auctions off for crazy amounts of money. And so people were really sort of dead set on trying to get their hands on the 25th set. That same Charizard card is, once again, back in this new set. What is different about this, more so than anything else, it does feel like the culture that exists around it is the thing that's really changed, right? Because while the 25th anniversary set was still a little hard to get your hands on, you could still just walk into a store and find it pretty easily. You might have to check a few stores, but it would usually be there. What's different now, it just feels like this reselling economy has really just blown up in a way that has made shortages feel huge to people. The Pokemon Company has tried to take steps to mitigate this because this is not unique to the 30th celebration set. 30th celebration, I think, gets into a lot of people's heads because they're not necessarily following it very closely. Every Pokemon set that drops has had shortages like this because of the reselling economy. The Pokemon Company, what have they done? They have instituted all kinds of onsite measures to try to keep you, to try to keep resellers from being able to get through. They've got this queue system that's really... There's a queue system and there is a really aggressive, "Are you a robot?" sort of system that I can't buy cards from the Pokemon Center on my home computer because my IP address has been flagged as like there was suspicious behavior. The suspicious behavior was me refreshing a lot. - Yeah, yeah. - (chuckles) Right? But in addition to the things that they've done on the website, The Pokemon Company has also upped production for these things. I think this is the second year in a row that they've printed something like 10 billion cards globally, and that's cards in multiple languages. We're not just specifically speaking about cards printed in English that are printed in English-speaking countries. Everywhere that Pokemon cards are sold, I don't necessarily know that the reselling problem is so huge in other countries, but the company has sensed that this is so much of a problem that we need to be printing more. Even with that increased capacity though, we're still seeing this being an issue, which is... It's tough, right? Obviously, I imagine that The Pokemon Company does not like this being attached to their product, right? I'm sure they love the sales, because at the end of the day, they win, the product is bought, it's not being stolen, per se, and so they're just sort of like, great. But it isn't a good look when a card game that is aimed at children is inaccessible to children because of unethically-behaving adults. - Yeah, I was going to ask you about this because a lot of people would make the argument, including a lot of these scalpers, that they're actually doing Nintendo a favor by making sure that they sell out of every single card that they print, right? It's a function of supply and demand, and if you have limited supply, there will always be demand. And so what do you think of those claims that people are making? Obviously, the scalpers are going to say this because they just want to keep scalping. But what incentive really does Nintendo have to make more cards besides the look of it not getting into the hands of enough kids? - I mean, I think the more that they increase production, the more sales they're going to be. I don't know how much The Pokemon Company would have to be printing in order to fully stamp this problem out. There are a few different solutions that they could take to try to address the issue. Printing more rare cards is the easiest, right? You flood the market with these things, and then they're value tanks, right? - Yeah. - People- - Is it good for Nintendo or bad for Nintendo if their value tanks? - I think it's neutral for Nintendo, right, because the value of a card doesn't really have any direct impact on Nintendo's bottom line. They're just sort of like, "Thank you so much for buying this pack of cards. The contents don't really mean all that much to us because we have your money." But you could note that if people are chasing a certain rarity of a card, then they're going to be more willing to buy more cards, right? - I think that's true. That's true to a point. As much as people sort of fixate on the idea like, "I'm the only one that has this," I don't think that cards dropping in rarity would actually stop people from buying Pokemon cards in mass. Yeah, just because they're cool. (chuckles) The resellers were like, "We're doing you a favor." Baby, I want to hold your hand when I say this, Pokemon doesn't need help. (laughs) They are one of the most durable and popular pieces of IP of all time. And your Discord, yes, it's contributing, but the business would be flourishing without that input. - Right, right. There's a couple of weird new types of businesses that have popped up around this, and you noted earlier that this probably started with TikTok LIVE and TikTok Shop. There's services like Whatnot where they will open Pokemon cards for customers that bought the pack live on a livestream. Can you tell me about this? What exactly is the draw here? - So Whatnot is... How was I describing it to my boyfriend earlier? Whatnot is like the unholy cross between TikTok, eBay, and QVC, all rolled into one where it's sort of like, "Hey, come watch me open stuff. You can pay for a certain amount of the stuff that I open." So the way that Ripper, it's called rip and ship, that's the general term for it. People will buy a box of Pokemon cards and usually organize them into little sections unopened where it's like, "Here's columns one, two, and three." You, the viewer, have the ability to purchase a certain amount of cards. So you can be like, "I want two packs from row A or row one, three packs from..." You know what I mean? You can do that. And then the person who is hosting the livestream will then rip them open with the idea being that everyone who is watching is sort of getting in on the dopamine hit of like, "Ooh, you're opening some packs, what's going to come out?" And the person who has purchased or purchased the dibs or the rights to that pack then is supposed to receive the cards that are ripped on stream, so the person who has been paid is meant to ship these things out. I don't love it. I think it's very... What are we doing here? But it's a thing that people do. And as scummy as it sounds, it gets even scummier when you watch it in particular because there are... I get into this in the piece, there are so many videos of people on these live streams clearly just trying to scam people. They'll be ripping a card and they will see, because if you open a pack of Pokemon cards, if you aren't careful, you can give yourself a little peek at what the rare card is in the back. They usually occupy a specific slot within the pack. I can't do it myself, but there's a way that when you open a pack, you can shuffle the cards around so that the rare card is like the last one. Oftentimes, these rip and ship people, they won't do that. They'll just open it up and start showing you one, two, three. There's so many videos where you see people, oh, that's like the chase card of the set that someone has bought for like $5. The person on camera will then, "Ooh, uh," and do some finagling offscreen to bring the cards back and be like, "Oh, wow, the rare card in this pack was a not so rare card. Whoops." It's very (chuckles), it's ridiculous because everybody can see it. (chuckles) You know what I mean? You would think that if you're really committed to scamming, you would find a better way to do this. You'd develop your slide of hand skills a little bit so that your theory wouldn't be so obvious. - Do people have any recourse in this? Because I feel like if people don't trust that system, the entire marketplace falls apart. - So Whatnot, so I forget what the exact percentage is, but rip and ships only make up a small percentage of all the commerce that happens on Whatnot. A lot of it is more like QVC where it's like, "Look at my shirt, do you want this shirt? Come buy this shirt." So I don't think it's enough of a problem for the platform to fully crack down as hard as they possibly could on these particular kinds of scammers. But it happens enough that I always find myself thinking, "Why would you do any kind of business there? Why would you engage with the platform?" - Yeah. Do you see all of this whole ecosystem and set of marketplaces expanding in the future? Do you see it contracting? Do you think it'll just keep sailing the way it is? It seems to have exploded quite a bit just in a few years, so I'm just curious if you think it can get even crazier than it currently is. - I mean, it could, right? It's hard to say. Pokemon's not going away. I don't think Pokemon is going to fall out of favor anytime soon. There's new children being born every day, and quite a few of them are going to be into Pokemon. Will this reselling economy go away? Probably not, right? We are (chuckles) we are hurdling towards our recession, and everyone is out here sort of hurting for cash. And this, for the people who choose to get into it, it is a viable way to make quite a bit of money doing minimal work work, you know what I mean? So I don't imagine this going away anytime soon. I reached out to a few scalpers to sort of ask them what would it take for another franchise to pop off the way Pokemon has and to supplant it in this space? And they were all sort of like, "I don't know" because there have been so many imitators. I do not think that there's ever going to be an aftermarket for Palworld cards. You know what I mean? I think Palworld cards exist. But even for more established pieces of IP like Digimon. - Baseball cards. - Or baseball cards. I know there are people who collect baseball cards. I don't know what they do with them. But again, baseball cards are just always in the store. They're not hard to come by. In order for something to take on the prominence that Pokemon has, it would have to be a phenomenon like Pokemon. We're talking about the cards, but the franchise includes the games, the spinoff games, the movies, the TV show. That is the kind of full court press that's necessary to make this particular kind of product an object of desire for a huge group of people. And without all of those other mechanisms in place, I think it would be really hard for another kind of product to supplant Pokemon in this position. As I say that I'm thinking to myself, the kids right now are really obsessed with squishy things. I don't know if you've seen any of those videos. - No, (laughs) no. - I keep saying fascinating because I am fascinated and deeply confused by it, but I don't know what they're called exactly, but they are these blind boxes that are shaped like steaming containers. And within the container is a squishy bow that has eyes and a face and- - Bow like a bow bun that you would eat? - Yeah, like a bun or like a dumpling. And they have eyes and faces, and the only main difference is the color and the glitteriness of them. I don't know what the kids are doing with them, but they are huge. I was in a Five Below the other day and there were signs up saying like, "Oh, two squishables per person." And there was a mother and her daughter in front of me and they both, they got into a conversation like, "Well, we're two people, so give us four." (chuckles) - Wow, interesting. - And they were like, "No, no, two per sale." And that comes and goes, I feel. I feel the last time I was attuned to, I don't have children in my life, so I'm not really always sure what's going on with the kids, but it feels similar to the way that... Remember Silly Bandz? They were like rubber bands that were shaped like things, like this one's shaped like a dinosaur. They were huge with- - No, I don't. (laughs) - They were huge with kids for like a hot second and then they just sort of disappeared. And I think that's normal, right? Because again, these are things for kids and kids get fixated on weird little things that don't necessarily have any function or value. They're just like, "I like it. I like stretching it or squishing it." That those come and go. But Pokemon, because that system that I was talking about before exists, you can collect Pokemon cards, you can play with them, you can get into the competitive scene and try to get into that whole world. And if you go all the way, you can make some serious money becoming a competitive player, or you could get into the reselling thing. There's all these things that you can do with Pokemon cards that I think gives people an incentive to be interested in them. - So you think they have more staying power than something like a Beanie Baby or a poppy flower. - But exactly, right? What are you meant to do with a Beanie Baby? You look at it, you put it in a little case, and you say, "Wow, this one is dedicated to Princess Diana. Wonderful." (chuckles) But it doesn't do much more than that. But Pokemon cards have multiple uses to them. - Yeah, all right. Well, Charles, thank you so much for joining us. I really appreciate it. - Of course. This was great. - Everyone should go read this piece. That's it for "The Vergecast." Let us know what you think. Call the hotline, 866-VERGE11, or email vergecast@theverge.com. And to support everything we do here and to get ad-free podcasts, subscribe to "The Verge." We're part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. "The Vergecast" is produced by Josh Cajas, Erick Gomez, Brandon Keefer, and Travis Larchuk. See you next time. Rock and roll. (bright jingle)